“But Alex, Do I have to run a discovery call? Can’t I just send an email instead?!”
If you dread sales calls, then this is for you…
In this interview, you’re about to learn the mindset tools and sales secrets that’ll help you:
✅ Show up more confidently
✅ Position yourself with expert authority
✅ Ask the right questions to get more “yesses”
✅ Charge more for your services
✅ And so much more…
Hey Posse! What’s up? It’s Alex.
And I’m so excited to bring you this EXCLUSIVE interview with David Neagle and Steph Tuss from the multi-million dollar global training company – Life Is Now, Inc.
If you love these expert interviews – and want to see more – then be sure to like & comment below.
Now you’re really getting a juicy interview today because I had to honor of sitting down with BOTH Steph and David to talk about everyone’s favorite topic *cringe* SALES!
David Neagle is the founder of the multimillion-dollar consulting company – Life is Now, Inc., and host of the Podcast – The Successful Mind.
He’s been in the professional development industry for more than 20 years…
Working alongside absolute legends like: Bob Proctor, Tony Robbins, Jen Sincero, and countless others…
Steph Tuss joined the Life is Now team in 2009 as the Director of Sales. And today, she’s the CEO of the company and frequently joins The Successful Mind Podcast as co-host.
She’s the primary driver behind all of Life Is Now’s marketing, business development, and brilliant team culture.
Together, these two have helped thousands of entrepreneurs, experts and self-employed professionals gain confidence and find the mindset needed to increase their revenue and turn their endeavors into seven-and-eight-figure ventures.
Both David and Steph have led training inside my high-level mentorship program, Reign, and it was SO good, I knew I had to invite them both for a power-duo interview on what you can do to take your discovery calls to the NEXT LEVEL.
I’ve in this business for over a decade – and I STILL took away so many juicy nuggets from this conversation.
I think you’re really going to love this one.
Let’s get into the interview!
How To Lead A Discovery Call
So I have been on this crazy journey of entrepreneurship for the last 10 years, and at the beginning, I probably wouldn’t have agreed with anyone if they said that entrepreneurship is 90% mindset, and now more than 10 years in, I’m like, oh yeah, entrepreneurship is 90% mindset. And while I absolutely love learning the tactical, the strategies, the know-how…
I think it’s really important to talk about really what goes on in a successful entrepreneur’s mind, how do they overcome doubts, how do they show up with confidence? And that is why I have invited you both here to talk to my Posse about all things sales and entrepreneurship and, of course, the mindset that goes around with it. Once again, welcome. I’m so glad you both are here.
Thanks for having us!
So I’m just gonna dive right into the questions, ’cause I know we have a lot of very, very juicy things to cover today. So one of the things that you say, and I’d love for you to explain this a little bit, because it’s interesting to me is the decision precedes the how. So can you break that down a little bit for those who might not be familiar with you and your business and everything that you do at Life Is Now, what does that mean exactly?
Yeah, that’s a great one. So I’m gonna take you back just a little bit, like about 25 years ago when I worked with my mentor. The number one thing that that guy taught me was how to make a decision. And one of the things that he kind of explained in the beginning when he would do seminars was that, as human beings, it’s decision is the number one thing that changes and creates our life, yet it’s something that we’re not actually taught how to evaluate, how to do and how to commit to as we go through our life. So most people are raised with this idea that, you know, they need to get through life in a way where they don’t create too much trouble and they don’t make too many mistakes, like they kind of safely get through life.
The old saying is, you tiptoe through life hoping to make it safely to death. So when you have that kind of a mindset, the idea is that you want to know how before you decide to do something, because you might make a mistake or you might do something wrong, or you might get in trouble or you might be judged by other people. So then what happens is that you’re making decisions based on this idea of a how that you probably know very little about. It forces you kind of into a pen in a bit of a way where your life gets controlled by what feels safe or what doesn’t feel safe.
What we don’t really know and what we’re not really educated on is the idea that when you make a decision, first of all, our most powerful attribute is our ability to choose, right? That’s where our power is as human beings, we create our entire life based on how we choose. So if we choose something, we then tell our mind to focus on the how afterwards, based on the decision that we make, not based on what it is that we know and how do we evaluate that without any education or data in order to make a decision. So the decision has to come first. When you make that decision first, everything begins to fall in line as to what patterns, what people, what information, what ideas do you follow in order to create that in your life.
Mm, gosh, everything you said there resonates with me so much. And I’m guilty of that. There’s times when I look back at choices that I’ve made in my business that didn’t really feel aligned or they didn’t even really feel like my decisions. It was sort of like, things were happening rather than me making things happen. And so I love that idea of there’s so much power in just the decision. Decide, it doesn’t mean that things will always go your way, and I think that’s like the mindset shift is just deciding and then moving forward in alignment with that decision. It doesn’t mean that everything’s gonna work out perfectly, but really flexing that decision muscle.
The decision gives you data. Decisions give you data. And then you make more decisions based on the data.
Right. And even in sales conversations, you know, I think oftentimes we get into sales conversations thinking, I need this person to say yes to me. And that almost puts us in this sort of like desperate, “Oh my gosh, I need to make a sale.” And something that I have found is really powerful is thinking, okay, I’m going into the sales conversation just to get the other person to make an aligned decision, because it’s so easy to stay in that like wishy-washy, I don’t know, indecisive energy, which doesn’t serve anybody. So going into a sales conversation, just being like, how can I get you to decide yes or no in a row because that’s gonna serve us both?
Yeah, for sure.
I love that. So, of course, a lot of decision-making comes from this place of confidence and believing that we are worthy of these decisions that we’re making for ourselves and in our business. So what advice would you give someone listening that’s like, okay, I wanna make a decision, but I don’t really trust myself or I don’t believe that I’m worthy of the success that I’m deciding I want?
Go ahead, Steph. You’re the trust queen.
So the idea is that you build your belief muscle as you’re going through the motions, right? So the idea is that you’re consistently taking forward motion in some way, shape or form. Most people don’t trust themselves to follow through on their decisions because it’s completely acceptable to break your word with yourself over and over and over again, right? Like how many times have you heard people, you know, create New Year’s resolutions or set a big goal and then not follow through or not do what they say they’re gonna do? Every time you do that, you break trust with yourself.
So in terms of your question, how do they move into a place of believing they are worth the success? I think that’s a different question. So if you have a desire, then you are worth that desire, you wouldn’t have a desire to begin with. You have a desire for a reason, right? Like, I mean, it’s what David teaches in terms of the universal law of polarity, you can’t have a desire without the possibility of that desire already present and in your space at the same time. So just by the fact that you want something different or you have a desire means you are worthy of that. But then the question is, how do you get over the fear of taking action toward that thing you want? And unfortunately, the answer is you don’t.
You don’t get over fear. You can’t intellectualize yourself through fear. You can’t think your way around fear. You have to take it by the hand and show it who’s boss. And you do that by taking action in the direction that you wanna go, by doing that one thing you’ve been resisting doing or those two things that you’ve been resisting doing. Does that make sense?
Yeah, absolutely. And I think it goes back to that, this idea of like, ready is not a feeling, it’s a decision, you know. It’s like you decide to move forward, and you’re gonna feel it all anyway. There’s never gonna be that perfect moment where you’re like, now, I have the experience, the confidence, you know, fill in the blank, whatever stories we tell ourselves about why we’re not ready to move forward. I would love to hear a little bit more about this idea of polarity that you mentioned about, you know. If you have this desire, then by its very nature, you are also worthy of that. Can you talk a little bit more about that?
Yeah, absolutely. So there’s seven natural laws to the universe that exist in both science and religion. They’re in everything. It’s the basis of how life exists and how we think in this world. And one of those laws is the law of polarity, which means that everything has an opposite, an opposite side to it. And it’s equal and opposite. You can’t have just one side of something without the other. And what’s fascinating about this is that I think most people know that to some degree, but they don’t actually understand how powerful it is.
Because essentially what it means in the context of which you’re framing the question is that, if I have a desire inside of myself and I think that I don’t have the things that I need to acquire what it is that I want or create what I want, that’s actually an ignorant statement, that’s based on somebody else’s belief system. If I have a desire in me, the opposite side of it is that I have all the things that are requisite in order to produce that desire. However, this is the important part. The other things will not expose themselves until you make a decision to move in the direction of the desire. The decision has to come first and then you expose the things that you need in order to manifest desire.
And like you just talked about fear, one of the ideas with fear is that we have something inside of us that allows us to overcome fear. It’s called courage. But courage isn’t there just hanging out in the room with you, right? Courage comes forward once you make a decision to do something in the face of the fear that you’re feeling about the thing that you want to do. Then courage comes up, right, because it’s the opposite side. So it shows up. But that exists in all of us. Every person on the planet has those qualities inside of themselves, but they have to be exercised in order to bring out the opposite side into the fruition of what you’re doing.
Oh, I love that. Yeah, I love that you have to feed your courage fear in order for it to thrive. So that makes perfect.
That’s a good way of putting it.
I really like that. Okay, so moving into this idea of sales conversations, ’cause I know sales, to a lot of people is this kind of big, scary beast, especially when you’re trying to start a business and, you know, Steph, I heard you say this before, that you don’t have a business without sales, and so there’s no way around it.
Anyone who wants to start a business needs to understand sales, needs to embrace sales, and obviously go about it in a way that feels very aligned with them. But what tools exist or that you can share can help, you know, our listeners put themselves into a place of authority and confidence when they are stepping into a sales conversation?
So I think one tangible strategy is to take control of the conversation from the very beginning, right? A big mistake that I see with people in sales conversations is they show up trying to like, create more comfort in the conversation rather than create more control in the conversation. So they’ll show up in the conversation and say, oh, hi, how are you doing? Where do you live? What’s the weather like there? And the person on the other end is not sure who’s actually in charge of the conversation and they’re actually picking up on a lack of confidence from the salesperson.
So one strategy is, immediately, when you get on the sales conversation, state the purpose of the call, state what you’re going to accomplish on the call, and then immediately take charge by asking the first question. That allows the other person to know this person’s in charge and they’re confident, and I don’t need to be thinking about what I’m gonna say or how I’m gonna navigate this conversation, they actually relax into it and they know that the salesperson has the reins and they’re grateful that the salesperson has the reins.
Yeah, I love that. It’s such a subtle shift, right? But it’s like starting the conversation immediately because it’s really easy for it to kind of get away from you and go in the other direction, and then next thing you know, you’re being grilled with questions and you’re like, wait a second, I’m supposed to be leading this sales call. And so setting the tone early on. And so you mentioned, you know, leading and asking the first question, what are the important questions to ask during a sales conversation to make sure that, you know, the prospect is a right fit and that you’re not wasting anyone’s time and, you know, obviously eventually to get the sale?
Well, think about, let’s think about something that comes a little bit before that, that really helps the salesperson feel empowered and know why they’re asking the questions that they are. Every sound you make, every noise that you make, every question you ask, every statement that you claim causes a reaction in that potential prospect’s mind that you have no control over, right? Because people show up reactionary to most things. They’re reacting to what it is that you’re saying, you’re doing, and they don’t even realize that they’re reacting. So one of the things that we teach people is that, primarily, you should be asking questions because you already have their subconscious mind working with you in the sale.
Meaning that if I ask you a question, generally, you don’t think to yourself, should I answer this question? You think, how you’re going to answer the question, right? So we’re actually working together, as Steph was pointing out, within that framework. But the key is that after you do what Steph just said, to set the call up so that they know that you’re the authority in there, what you wanna do is think to yourself, what questions do I want to ask based on the answers that I want to get for myself, because it’s gonna be reactionary, right? So the first thing that I wanna know is, what do you want? What is it that you actually want? And we stay with that question until we tap into the person’s emotional desire of what it is.
And it doesn’t matter what you’re selling, right? Because people, most of the time, like 99. 98% of the time, people buy emotionally, right? They tap into their emotional self to allow themself to want something, even if it’s something that they need, right? Because they have to trade something in order to buy anything in their life. So asking them what they want and sticking with that question until you get to the truth of what that is, we think is imperative. And the reason why is this, because really in a sales conversation they’re selling themselves. I mean, the whole idea is to get to a yes or a no, not to convince them to do anything. But they will convince themselves. Like if they can openly and honestly say, hey, listen, this is the reason that I want, here’s what I want and here’s the reason that I want this, nothing you could ever say will have as much power as that admission of themselves say what it is that they want. So that’s the first thing that we do in that, in the lineage of questions.
Well, basically, it’s only four questions that we ask them, right? I mean, we might move around a little bit depending on what it is that you’re selling and what the scenario is, but here’s what it looks like. You ask them what they want, you ask them why they believe that they’re not getting it. Now that question’s not appropriate for every sale that a person makes, right? But the idea is that if you are making any kind of a sale where you need the participation of the person that you’re selling to play a role in how well they get the result based on that sale, like, you know, we work with business owners, right, so we need them to participate huge in their own sale. Like if they say yes to us, there’s a lot of work that they have to do.
One of the things that we want to know is how does this person see the world? If I say, tell me why you’re not getting the thing that you want, and immediately they go into blame, they start blaming other people or situations or things, doesn’t necessarily mean we wouldn’t work with them, but it does tell you what their viewpoint is, right? They see the world kind of from a victim perspective. If they say, hey, listen, I know exactly why I’m not doing this, because I don’t know enough or I’m making mistakes, I don’t know what to do. That’s a completely different idea that you can work with. So that tells you a lot. You don’t have to do much with it, but it’s really good to know what’s the mindset of the person that I’m actually selling?
And you can do this with a car, you can do it with a house, you can do it with basically anything. The next question is kind of like a consequence question. So the first question you said is what do you want? That kinds of sets a pillar of truth in the conversation. A person’s not gonna go back on that and say, oh, I didn’t really want that, right? They want that. So then the third question is, what happens if you don’t get this, right? Obviously, you tailor it to whatever you’re selling, but what happens if you don’t get this, if you don’t do this, if you don’t make a decision, whatever it is? In other words, there’s a consequence today for making a choice, right? At the end of our conversation, you’re gonna be a yes or a no.
What’s the consequence if you say no? Is there a consequence? And in the discovery of that answer, you also set up and you bring forth the urgency for the sale if it actually exists. It comes right to the surface, that urgency, because a person’s gonna tell you how important it is that they do this. And then Steph and I do things a little bit different at this place based on our personality. One of the things that I’ll do is I’ll ask them how serious are they about the result that they want, right? I ask them to buy in a little bit deeper. Steph usually comes from the place of exciting the possibility on that end, which they both accomplish the same thing, right? And we both interchange those depending on who we’re talking to, but that’s really just kind of like a personality fit.
Like how did you feel yourself through the conversation with that person? And then from there, it’s about making a decision. If they’re a yes, if they’re committed, if they can see themselves and are excited about whatever the answer is for them, there’s no small talk, there’s no nothing. It is immediately getting them to the decision process and then working through that from there. Steph, do you wanna add anything to that?
No, that’s the exact way that I would answer. I think in the first question with what do they want, we also try to get to the why. We’re looking for that emotional why they want, what it is that they want. And it generally comes out in one and the same in that question.
Yeah. One question I have around that first question is, I find and I’m kind of trying to put myself in the shoes of the Posse here, where they might get on a sales call and they’re like, okay, you know, what is it that you want? Oftentimes, and I’m sure you experience this, people very much lead with like, I need copywriting. So, let’s say, I need a sales page and some emails. How do you then get more to the emotional kind of desire?
Because at the end of the day, oftentimes, something like copywriting or really any service can seem to be this very transactional thing, when in reality, you know, oftentimes, what they actually need is someone to come in and be a true partner with them and to help navigate marketing and brainstorm ideas, and it’s not just this transactional, I’m gonna pay you to write this and then we’re done, so how would you, if you were, let’s say, a copywriter on a sales call and someone just got back to you and said, I want copywriting, I need six emails, how would a copywriter then sort of take back control of the conversation to really get to the core of what it is that they want?
So I would dig there, like David said previously. I would dig. You know, tell me about why you need these six emails. What are you hoping to accomplish with these six emails? What has stopped you in the past from having someone that can write these effectively? What are the results that you’ve had in the past that you don’t like? So I would just continue to ask clarifying questions until I get to the bottom of what the real problem is. Because having someone write six emails is not, you’re right, it’s not actually what they want, right? They wanna be able to hand something off, they wanna be able to have something in their own voice that represents who they are to an audience, they wanna be able to count on the person to meet a deadline and to get things done.
You know, it’s way bigger than, and I know this, ’cause I’ve had multiple conversations with copywriters, right? Like it’s a way bigger conversation than just I need six emails. So your job as a salesperson is to help them really bring clarity to exactly what it is that they do want, because they may think that they just want six emails and the sales page, right? So it’s your job as a salesperson to ask those questions so that they can understand what it is that they really want and you can understand what they really want, so you know if you can even help them.
Yeah. Yeah, and there’s something so, so juicy about that too, because I think immediately, when you start digging a little, you’re showing that potential client, hey, you understand more than just copywriting. You understand how to ask the questions to really get an idea of like, okay, they told you what they want, but what do they really want? And I talk about that all the time in copywriting. It’s easy for someone to say, you want more money and freedom?
Yeah, don’t we all? But why does your audience really want more money and freedom? And so it’s really using your copywriting skills, to everyone listening, to dig a bit deeper because we all know that what we say we want is not always the deep down reason, an emotional desire behind what we want. So yeah, that’s incredible advice. Can you explain this idea of value conflict, and first of all what that means and then how it shows up in sales?
In sales? Yeah, absolutely. So the idea comes, it stems from this, that people very often want something that is gonna solve a problem or get them to another level in their life or their business, whatever it is that they’re doing. And the way that they need to get there, they actually have a conflict with that process. Like for an easy value conflict is money, right? A person tells, hey, I need copy, for instance, right? Because I really want to hit these goals in my business. I want to expand, I wanna scale. And you tell them what the price is. And in their mind they think that they can’t afford to do that. That’s a value conflict, right? That’s not actually a money problem.
People think it’s a money problem but it isn’t because value will trump whatever it is that you don’t think that you have if the urgency is there to do it. It’s kind of like the old idea where if somebody said to you, hey, listen, if you had somebody that you loved tremendously and they were dying, but spending this amount of money could actually save them, would you then say you didn’t have the money or would you figure out a way to do it or everybody would figure out a way to do it? But what’s interesting is what they’d be willing to do to figure out a way to do it. They would beg, borrow, or steal if it was something that was that important. So all of a sudden the values go out the window if the urgency is correct, right? So it’s fascinating.
But when you’re talking about something that will advance you as a person, and you’re saying, I don’t have the money for that, now we’re dealing with a value of you thinking less of yourself as an individual, not deserving to have the better thing that you need that’s going to move you forward. So Steph and I deal with this on a daily basis with people, because it comes from something called their core wound, and typically what it is, is that there’s something in their past that they keep reflecting upon unconsciously that says that they’re not enough, right? So here’s this opportunity for them to purchase a service that somebody has that’s gonna allow them to really do amazing things.
And it may be quite expensive. That might be very true. It could also cause, the cause could be time, right? But if they don’t think that they’re good enough to do it, then all of a sudden the problem itself seems to have more weight than the actual value of them wanting to be moving forward because of what they truly want. Overcoming the obstacle now has more value, what it’s gonna cost them versus what they want, that’s a value conflict.
Yeah, that makes perfect sense. And I love the reframe on, you know, we’ve all heard of price objection, you know, like, oh yeah, it’s just too much. And I think it’s easy to be like, okay, like I guess they just can’t afford it. But I love the idea of going, okay, how do we actually lean into this a little bit more and think what is really going on here? Because just like there’s the what they want and then what they really want, there’s what they’re saying is the reason why they can’t move forward with you, but then what the real reason is, and how can you try to navigate that value conflict in a way that ultimately helps them move forward.
And I’ve been through that in my business multiple times where, you know, you hear the price, and immediately you’re like, woo, okay well, and it’s so easy to just immediately like, nope, just can’t afford that. But this idea of like being worthy of making that investment and then also you showing up on the flip side of that and believing in the value that you bring, because I think that is a really common thing that I noticed that comes up with a lot of my higher level copywriters is they know they have this skills, but then there’s this little thing inside that doubts whether or not they can actually bring the value or the results that they want to in order to help their client. And so I guess it happens on both sides.
It happens on both sides, but that value based on what the client gets has everything to do with what they say that they want in the beginning of the conversation. That’s why Steph was saying the why is so important. You’re establishing value in the beginning of that conversation that becomes undeniable at the end of the conversation. So very often, the conflict, it doesn’t match. The reason that they say that they can’t move forward doesn’t match what it is that they said that they want. But that tells the salesperson how to overcome the problem, what problem they’re actually dealing with.
Yeah. That’s so good. So how, when you’re on a, let’s say, sales conversation, how can you recognize whether your prospect is responding from a past experience or doubt that they have versus them responding from a, no, I don’t need this, does this come back to that first question?
Well, I guess that depends on how they answer the question. So are you asking that if they say that it’s too much money or how are they actually communicating to you that they’re saying no?
Yeah, so I mean, I guess I’m just thinking of, if you’re going into a sales conversation and you’re speaking to a prospect and they, let’s say they say no to whatever it is you’re offering even though they have said what they want, they answered that question, you’re coming in with a solution or a path to help them get there, and for some reason they’re still not buying what you’re selling, is there a way to kind of distinguish, is this really a misalignment of what they said they wanted or is this them reacting to a past experience perhaps and projecting? And is there a way to sort of navigate that?
Yeah, I think there is. And first of all, I think if it’s a misalignment, I think the salesperson should recognize it first. I think that’s our responsibility first, to recognize a misalignment, right? That keeps us in integrity and not signing up people that we shouldn’t be signing up, which creates a whole another slew of issues. But the other thing is, rarely will somebody say no without giving you some kind of an explanation as to why they’re actually saying no. And you have to listen to what it is that they’re saying. If a person says no and gives you no explanation, I would ask why, tell me why you’re saying no, right? I want to know why. It doesn’t mean that I’m gonna force you or do anything like that, but I would really like to understand why you’re saying no.
That gives me some insight into what your thought process is. Generally, what happens, if we’re working now, let’s say it’s a fit, we know it’s a fit, this person has something that they want, we know that we can deliver, we know that we can provide great value and they’re saying no, what they’re generally saying no to at that time is something that they believe is an obstacle that they don’t know how to overcome. So our job in that moment is to help them overcome that problem. And I simply just ask, like I don’t try to skirt around the issue. I’ll say, listen, if we can solve that problem together right now, on this call, will you commit to doing it, right?
If the person’s telling you the truth, they’ll say yes. If they’re lying, they’ll say no. Because really what they’re saying at that point is that they don’t have the courage to actually say no. And believe it or not, it is a huge issue with almost every human. People don’t like to say no to other people. So we lie and we make excuses instead of going no thank you. Maybe I don’t like you, right? Like, no, thank you, I just don’t wanna work with you.
Yeah. Yeah, and at the end of the day, I mean, I love what you said, it’s sort of on you as the salesperson to recognize that, I mean, there is so much power in saying, I don’t think we’re a fit. I mean, I know from my own experience, when I got to that point in my business where I actually could not possibly take on more work, and I would say that very honestly, that’s when they, it’s almost like they want you more.
And so I always try to think like, if you’re just getting started, and yes, you might really need that client, but if you know, deep down, that there isn’t an alignment there for whatever reason, being able to hold that boundary for yourself and for them knowing that, you know what, this isn’t gonna be a fit, either you would be compromising your values or you wouldn’t be really serving your client, there’s so much power in just deciding. Yeah, you know what, it’s been so great to connect. And the more I hear about what you’re looking for, I just don’t think I’m the fit for you. It’s powerful. It’s absolutely powerful.
So I have a question just about mindset and strategies for reprogramming and reframing your mindset, because as I mentioned at the beginning of this interview, in my experience, mindset is absolutely everything, and I’m sure you’ll agree, but as people are embarking down this path, what are some ways that you can reprogram or reframe your mind to be more successful? I know it doesn’t happen overnight, but are there certain ways that one can do that?
Well, I think part of this, especially going into a sales conversation is, the reframe is that this sales conversation isn’t about you. It’s about being in service to the other person. So you’re shifting from an energy of getting to giving, right? And when you do that, the energy around the whole thing changes, and suddenly you take on a different role. Like everyone likes to be helpful to someone else. Your job in a sales conversation is to be helpful, it’s to bring clarity to a confused mind, is to help them make a decision whether it’s working with you or not. So really understanding and grounding yourself in that role of, I’m here to serve, I’m here to support, I’m here to help you make a decision whether that’s with me or not with me, puts you in an entirely different energy where you don’t really need to shift your mind.
Like you know what that feels like to be helpful to someone else, right? Like if anyone came and asked you for help, you would help them. So it’s a different shift in how you are feeling, how you’re viewing the purpose of the sales call to begin with. Awareness is only part of how you overcome this. You can read bugs and become aware of your issues and become aware of your limiting beliefs till the cows come home, but nothing changes until you create a new experience. And the only way to create a new experience is to implement a new behavior, right?
Nothing changes when you’re in resistance. Nothing changes when you’re in inaction. So the only way through it is to take forward action. Allow yourself to have the experience of taking forward action. And that really breaks through and opportunities start coming to you. There’s no way to think yourself into a new mindset. Awareness is important, so you understand what’s going on, you can make a conscious choice, but once you’ve made that conscious choice, you’ve gotta take action.
Absolutely. Yeah. It’s been so interesting just in my own journey as someone who’s always really been into personal development. You know, I have read so many books, I’ve studied so many mindset, you know, tricks and quotes and all of that, and there’s times even still, in my business, where something happens and I reflect back and I’m like, oh, I have a little bit of work to do there. And you don’t realize a lot of that until you lean in and start moving forward. And so I don’t think, I don’t think how it works is you get your mindset right and then you’re ready to move forward and take action and build the business that you want.
It’s taking messy and imperfect action and then getting feedback and going, why does that feel that way or why did I respond in that way? And then kind of tweaking as you go. And that happens, I’m sure, at every single level. I mean, you guys have worked with entrepreneurs, thousands of entrepreneurs at so many different levels, helping them break through to the next level, and would you say that that’s true and that even people who have, let’s say multimillion-dollar businesses are still sort of learning and going, ah, interesting, I just had a little bit of a mindset shift there as they continue to grow?
Yeah, for sure. One of the things, here’s a tool that we give people. Because we find this with entrepreneurs, I think it’s a little more relevant, just because here you have somebody that has a vision and they probably also like to be in control at the same time, one of the things that can be very detrimental is the need to be right. So what we say is, you need to shift that value to the truth, right? We’re gonna value the truth more than anything else.
And if that means that we’re wrong, we can accept that. We wanna find out what’s right so that we can make the changes that are necessary in order to produce the results that we want. So that’s a value shift, because it can’t, there again, it can be a value conflict, right? Here’s something, here’s a mistake that I keep making or a result that I keep getting that I don’t want, and I’m unwilling to look at what’s causing it, which is me.
Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Looking at that I think is a big one. And I can relate to that, being an entrepreneur, starting a business, I think you get to this point of okay, wait, I might not have all of the answers and that’s okay. I don’t need to be right as long as, as you said, that value shift, as long as we’re getting results. Thank you for that. That’s super helpful. And I think everyone listening will agree. And speaking of tools, I know that, Steph, you were talking about a couple of tools that you can gift to the Posse. Can you explain a little bit about what those are so that they can grab their copy?
Absolutely. We have a sales blueprint that we use with all of our clients that lays out the key questions to ask in a sales conversation. And it’s a PDF, you know, and it’s kind of a flow chart where you say this, and if they say this, this is a question you can ask in response. So it’s super valuable. We’re happy to give it to your audience to help them. The idea is that you have a framework around the questions that you ask, not that you use it as a script, ’cause if you’re using it as a script, you’re not listening to your potential client or your prospect. So it’s a framework.
And then the other tool is we’ve created a leadership assessment. And the great thing about this leadership assessment is that it pertains to every area of your life, whether you’re a leader in your family, whether you’re a leader of your business, whether you’re a leader in your community or your church, you take this assessment, and the results that you get show you what your strengths and your potential weaknesses are, and then it gives you tips on how to overcome those weaknesses.
And how you do anything is how you do everything. So this applies to how you lead in sales conversation, that applies to how you lead any team members that you might have, it applies to how you lead yourself. Just a really valuable resource that is on our website, that you can take, and will give you some deep insight into who you are. So if you have those weaknesses, you can see them before they actually cause problems in your life and work to overcome them beforehand.
Amazing. Thank you so, so much for those. To everyone listening, you can grab both of those. Just click the links to grab both the sales conversation blueprint and the leadership assessment. Those are two insanely valuable tools, especially after this conversation we just had about sales conversations. I know sometimes it can be overwhelming when you’re just starting out and you have to start having those conversations.
So having that structure will really make you feel supported, so that, again, not using them as a script, but knowing how to guide conversation, which will then, in turn, make you a better leader, will allow you to step into more authority when you’re leading these sales calls, and, again, like we talked about earlier, you only get better by actually leaning in and taking action and making a decision and saying, okay, this is it, I’m gonna go for it.
Thank you both so much, David and Steph! I enjoyed this conversation immensely and I know everyone listening will too. So thank you so much for being here to share your wisdom with us.
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